Yeah, I stopped going to enclosed dog parks because my Shiba was picking up a lot of bad social habits. The dog parks we visited were very high stimulus, with very little structure and supervision. Sometimes, people would bring in young kids who ran around playing and shouting.

In the end, we did smaller, structured play-groups, with dogs that I know will fit well with Sephy’s temperament. I supervised during play, we had play rules, everyone had a good time, and Sephy learned good social behaviors.

I think it really depends a lot on the temperament of the dog, his social tolerance level, and how negative experiences affect him. The problem with enclosed dog parks is that it is very unpredictable, and as you say, things can escalate very quickly.

More on Sephy’s dog park experiences. (The comments section has more on other people’s experiences at the dog park.)

http://www.badrap.org/dogdog-tolerance
http://www.badrap.org/smart-socializing

My Belgian Shepherd, Obsidian, is a really great dog, really. However, he has a bit of a thing with mistrust with CERTAIN dogs. Usually intact males (more passive intact males he does not mind) or very rude dogs. I guess I’ll just give a scenario to make my concern clear.

Today we were at the dog park and he met a new dog there, young Rottie named Turner. Very sweet dog–a little clingy. They did the behind sniff–it was very good. No tension, just hellos. Obsidian is doing his thing: greeting the “regulars,” his friends, the people, etc. Turner comes up to him, right into his face, and Obsidian just bares his teeth–no noise. See, that’s what he only does: bares his teeth. That’s it! No growling. He get some whale eye, or turn his head away–but Turner (or any dog a similar situation) just continues to stick its face closer and closer to Obsidian’s. Of course, Obsidian then snaps and tells the dog off. And, of course, it looks like Obsidian snapped for no reason, and I get nasty looks from the new dog’s owner. Turner then backed off, but tried to do it multiple times! I did not scold Ob for warning him, of course. I don’t want to teach him that his lip-raise is a bad thing so he should just snap first. I have been neutrally calling him to me just to get him out of the situation, since I can clearly see that the new dog is not reading Ob’s only sign.

He does not do this with every dog, just ones that he trusts less. Most new dogs he will trust immediately, and others he is more cautious. I can usually tell right before it’s going to be a problem due to the other dog’s manners, so I remove him. Don’t want to set him up for failure! Turner tried three times: first resulting in Obsidian telling him off, then me calling him back twice. After that it was no problem–Turner got the hint and they both were fine. Once a relationship and trust is built, Obsidian is great. And yes, there are been instances in the past when he was a puppy where dogs were rude, pushed him to his limits, and attacked him before I could intervene. That built this mistrust he has developed.

What is your advice for me? Should I just continue to call him away when I see that a dog is continuing to get in his face without heed of warning? I know removing him is an option, but I try not to because there are other dog friends with whom he can socialize. It’s just that ONE moment–but it never gets bloody unless the other dog is NOT dog park material at ALL and it is instigating fights.

Thank you so much!!

I used to always ‘correct’ my dogs when they growled or showed their teeth. Then I went to a local dog trainer who said if you don’t allow them to ‘warn’ (i.e. train them not to warn), then their next reaction will be to attack. Makes sense to me. I have never forgot that, and really try to pay attention now when my dogs are ‘warning’ about something.

I actually find it quite fulfulling to try to figure out what my dogs mean by their actions, reactions, and body language (of course, who knows if I’m getting right though)

My dog is a Westie and she’s not overly interested in being friends with every dog she meets. She sometimes meets a dog at the park who she instigates a play session with, but mostly she likes to hunt and sniff in the bushes for prey.

When she’s approached by big dogs, I always warn the owners that she will probably bite and to keep away. Polly gives no verbal warning and goes from sniffing and circling to attack. Big dog owners can’t believe that their dog is at risk and usually don’t listen – with disastrous results for their dog’s snout.

I’m getting Polly a new Westie to play with and having read your posts, I’ve got some great plans for introducing the new puppy safely so that Polly doesn’t see her as an (expensive) snack 🙂

Hi Cassie,
I agree with you 101%!!!

One time I met this clueless individual in the park who let his two little chihuahuas run around free-range even when he had absolutely no voice control over them. True, they are small dogs, but it is really unfair to the other dogs that have to endure rude yipping and invasion of space without being able to give an appropriate response.

I asked him to remove his dog from my Shiba’s space. He carried his dog 2 feet away and put him down again. DOH! Of course the dog came right back. Then he said that his dog wouldn’t be able to hurt my dog – DOH! but *my* dog can surely hurt his dog and then it will be bad news for everyone.

I seriously don’t understand what that guy was thinking. Even if we do not care about other people and other people’s dogs, we should at least care enough about our own dog to keep him safe by not letting him harass other dogs that could very easily kick his ass.

He becomes uncomfortable with strangers very easily, and barks to let them know he doesn’t want them coming near.

Yeah I think dogs are pretty clear when communicating to us that they are uncomfortable with people or other dogs crowding their space. Many people continue to give the dog eye contact though, which may continue to make the dog uncomfortable.

In general, I think the most difficult case is dealing with loose neighborhood dogs that are “friendly”, rush right up to you, invade your dogs space, and start getting in his face. Shania is a bit fearful when it comes to meeting other dogs and it is very unfair to subject her to rude dog greeting behavior. Quite simply –

People with no off-leash control should not leave their dogs off-leash.

You would be surprised how many people are so taken aback at this reaction!

We know he’s not always friendly, but we do know that he won’t hurt them. He’d rather run away and hide.

Hi Jess,
Glad you enjoyed it. Sephy is really the one with the talent. I just type what he tells me to. 😛

Also thank you very much for sending over photos of Zeus. Let me know if you want me to change anything on your poem.